[mod_python] Promoting Python as web application development language

Michael Neel neel at mediapulse.com
Sat Aug 24 16:29:39 EST 2002

Would it make since to have python.apache.org work the same as
jakarta.apache.org?  Then have mod_python, mod_snake, and any other
efforts listed as sub-projects.  Zope could be related link, but it
really does fit in with what I think of when I think "mod_python".  I
want mod_python to provide 2 very key parts; 1. provided an embedded
interperter so I can speed up a existing python code with little effort
and 2. provide a python API version of the Apache API. (I'm not saying
we don't have these bases covered, just say what I'm looking for in a
mod python project).  Zope is a tool for a different job.

If the sticking point is wether python.apache.org jumps to mod_python or
mod_snake, then just solve that now by linking to both as the java pages
do.  Once python has a higher visibility, the community will help it
become whatever it needs to become with reguards to apache.

BTW anyone want to make RedHat stop shipping python 1.5 as default and
giving you mod_python built against 1.5 as well? I can dream can't I?

Anyone ask Guido if he would make a phone call? =D

Michael C. Neel
There are only 10 types of people in the world;
those who understand binary and those who don't.

-----Original Message-----
From: mod_python-admin at modpython.org
[mailto:mod_python-admin at modpython.org] On Behalf Of vio
Sent: Saturday, August 24, 2002 10:16 AM
To: J?rgen Fr?jk Kj?rsgaard {Metation}
Cc: mod_python at modpython.org
Subject: Re: [mod_python] Promoting Python as web application
development language

Again Jorgen, many thanks for your reply. In a couple of emails you
outlined the framework of a possible 'python.apache.org' project. Its
goals, both 
strategic (to promote a unified effort in making Python a language of
on the Apache server) and tactical or technical (to integrate the main 
python_on_apache codebases, while maintaining an open door to
alternatives) are quite clear. The writing on the wall is "cooperation".
I would take it 
that your views more or less reflect those of the apache board.

Well, Fabian, I hope this would be of some help for your PR efforts, so
best of luck and hopefully you'll keep us in touch of your progress on
mod_python list. I guess it's your call from now on.

Warm regards,

* J?rgen Fr?jk Kj?rsgaard {Metation} <jfk at metation.com> [020824 08:39]:
> Lørdag 24. August 2002 12:36 skrev du:
> > If I read your Rivet analogy correctly, apache might be interested 
> > in giving its 'official' blessing (i.e. the powerful 
> > 'python.apache.org') to the python project who will manage to rally 
> > support from the web-python community at large. In this regard, 
> > Fabian's latest PR makes a lot of sense.
> Exactly.
> > But again speaking from a user's perspective, if I consider the 2 
> > web-python packages I know a little about - zope and mod_python - I 
> > don't see those code bases integrating anytime soon (simply because 
> > they serve 2 quite different audiences, and I would think they are 
> > rather entrenched). Because of this, should there be no 
> > 'python.apache.org' ?
> There should be a python.apache.org. The question is who should be 
> part of
> it? mod_python and Zope are very unlikely to integrate, but some
> may be possible. In the open source desktop area, KDE and Gnome
actually use 
> some common code today (KDE depends on the GNOME XML core libraries),
> though the groups couldn't stand eachother a few years ago.
> On the other hand, you are right when you say that Zope doesn't fit 
> very well
> in. Zope is not very tightly integrated with Apache. A
> would be very unlikely.
> I think python.apache.org should consist of mod_python, mod_snake, CGI

> Python
> and maybe a few others that I haven't even head about yet. Some time
in the 
> future, mod_python and mod_snake may integrate, though it may not seem

> possible today. A couple of years ago Rivet didn't seem possible
> tcl.apache.org succeeded because it is open to alternatives, it isn't 
> one
> mod_*.
> > I disagree. As long as there will be no official ralying point to 
> > attract
> > python+apache afficionados on a 'single point of effort', parallel 
> > python+efforts
> > will continue to florish, each more or less re-inventing the 
> > proverbial wheel. And not cooperating very much, I would think.
> Maybe our thoughts are not that different at all... The purpose of
> python.apache.org should be to expose Python more _and_ to promote a
> unified effort in making Python a language of choice on the Apache
> regards, Jørgen
> --
> Jørgen Frøjk Kjærsgaard, direktør og systemkonsulent
> Metation aps - Kystvejen 29, DK-8000 Århus C
> Web: www.metation.com  - Tlf: +45 8625 0038 - Mobil: +45 2925 6693
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